What Skin do we need??

[BSPeter]

Originally Posted by SergeNL

... in this Forum the last post is above on top. I think that is very annoying. Every time I start to read, I have to find out again I have to read from under up. That method may be good for long treads and dedicated forum visitors, but not here. What do you think?

What I think is that if you want it otherwise, you should simply set it to your own personal preference under "Thread Display Options - Thread Display Mode" which is accessible via "User CP" (most left option in the light blue bar at top of the forum) / "Settings and options - Edit Options".
(I personally use "Linear - Oldest first".)

P.S.:
(1) IMHO icons/buttons shouldn't need text (apart from ''hover over" help text)
(2) "color" (/) isn't English but American English.

[SergeNL]

Originally Posted by BSPeter

set it to your own personal preference under "Thread Display Options - Thread Display Mode" which is accessible via "User CP" (most left option in the light blue bar at top of the forum) / "Settings and options - Edit Options". (I personally use "Linear - Oldest first".)

Forum Display - default "Newest Post First" is a nightmare. (please change it)

Newcombers will always read from top to bottom. And everyone will be confused, and keep on being confused, until they learn that at BSP-forums everything is upside down.
(It's not so obvious, because many posts don't have a reply)

And if they come back next week, and have forgotten all about it, they again think "What the hell am I reading?", when they click on a subject. They don't see the initial post, but the last reply. And that reply - especially without a Quote or reference to a previous replay - may appear to be the initial post. That is ve-ry confusing..

And that's not all. Once they have learned to read from the bottom, they again get confused, when the thread has multiple pages. What they read on the bottom of page 1 is again not the initial post, but a reply in the middle (that again may look like an initial post.)

At other forums, at least the initial post stays on top. So if you click on the topic, you can immediately read what it is about. But then the confusion starts. The first reply you see, usually is not a reaction to the initial post above, but to someone elses reply beneath that. But until you see that, you again think "What the F.. is he talking about?".

I think "Linear - Oldest First" is the best for everyone, and best suited for the default setting. I don't think that choice is very personal.
Who benefits from "Latest First"? Only dedicated users, who look around a lot here. But they are the ones, that know how to change personal settings, and have a reason to make that special effort.

I think many things should be improved here. This Forum is not doing well in the last years. There are visitors, but do they find what they need? I don't see many new skins either. And I got here, simply because I couldn't find a skin, that I found practical enough. I think the skin is the downside of BSP at the moment, while so much is possible..

A small thing to start with is to change the default forum display to "lineair - Oldest".
And if possible, to change it for all previous treads to..

(I hope I do not sound too critical or offensive.. I value everyone, that keeps this thing alive, and don't blame anyone or anything. I just want to contribute to improvement..)

So thanks again for the reply, Peter! :-) (inspiring me to this) Is there a way of notifying the ones that decide about this? For now I repeat your advice here:

Change Forum Display to "Linear - Oldest Post First":

1. Click "User CP" at the top of a forum page, in the blue bar, the most left option.
2. On the left, under "Settings and Options", click "Edit Options".
3. Scroll down to "Thread Display Options", and choose "Linear - Oldest First".

[adicoto]

Regarding DVD issues.
First of all, you don't need DT to open ISOs. Just drop the ISO file onto BSPLayer's main window. It will play the file inside with no problems.

On the other hand, Title, Chapter and Menu functions are not strictlly related to DVDs, as today some other video containers support such features. So, taking them from the main menu and putting them somwhere else (such a DVD submenu) will confuse users.

[SergeNL]

Originally Posted by adicoto

Regarding DVD issues.
First of all, you don't need DT to open ISOs. Just drop the ISO file onto BSPLayer's main window. It will play the file inside with no problems.

On the other hand, Title, Chapter and Menu functions are not strictlly related to DVDs, as today some other video containers support such features. So, taking them from the main menu and putting them somwhere else (such a DVD submenu) will confuse users.

Good Lord!! Can you just drop an ISO on BSPlayer?! These BSP guys are terrible! (good :-)

Your remarks set me to work! :-)
If Dvd-funcions work properly from buttons on the Main Control Panel, they definitely should be in the skin!
There is no point in serving Freeware users only. A good skin should promote BSP, and should certainly serve the users that pay, and keep BSP alive. So I'll tickle freeware users a bit by adding a nice DVD image, that only will work in the payed BSP PRO.
I've seen enough skins without Dvd-support, so it must be done.

Currently I am doing a few things.
- Testing Dvd-buttons. Earlyer I had problems, so I'll download a few ISO's now.
- AddArea or Hotspot for extra Dvd-buttons? I couldn't add a second AddArea (can it be done?), and the first one was graphically not very suited for Dvd-functions. So it will be a Hotspot for DvD. Just found out how to do it technically.
- Redesigning the Skin for Dvd. (I'll be back in a few days..)

[adicoto]

I am refering to the fact that Title, Chapter and Menu functions in the main menu are also working with other (at least MKV) files and shouldn't be moved from there.

[SergeNL]

Originally Posted by adicoto

I am refering to the fact that Title, Chapter and Menu functions in the main menu are also working with other (at least MKV) files and shouldn't be moved from there.

Thanks for your reply! J But your simple remark got me puzzled for quite some time, about which Buttons to add, and how to organise them in the Main Control or the extended area’s (by button, or hotspot)?

Weeks ago I left DVD out of the skin, because of some issues. On second thought, a strong DVD-section in an extended area seemed to be a good idea. But there is no button for DVD-Open. And then your remark about MKV came. I decided to give it a good look, but ended up with the fact, that there are only 4 possible actions for DVD by Buttons in the skin. (Title, Chapters, Subtitles, and Audio Streams.)

Then I found out, 3 of 4 of these actions for DVD even did not work at all in Base Skin. (only “Title” sometimes works) They do work from the BSP Menu, but not by Button. I asked a question about that in the “Bugs and Codecs” Forum, but got no reply so far. So I have to assume, these buttons just don’t work. Even from the BSP Menu, these functions did not always work. Also I had problems finding a working Mpeg-2 splitter.

All together I became negative about BSP and DVD.
What I would want is a button, that opens an extended area for special functions.
The button would have a round Dvd-disc Icon, and a popup saying “DVD – ISO - MKV”.
Special function Buttons would be: Open (only working for Dvd and Iso), Root Menu, Titles, and Chapters.

But for now I think, the only thing that can be added on the Main Control, is a small disc-icon for “Title”.
Agree? Or do the DVD Buttons in Base Skin (or any other skin) work in your player?
Thanks and greeting..

[adicoto]

Persoanlly, I am a fan of ver 1 skin which doesn't have extended panel therefore never tested extra buttons. After reading your yesterday's post about, changed to base skin and found that, as you mentioned, buttons doesn't work. Lucky me, a colleague wanted a DVD and so I had a ISO on my HDD.
Probably many users never used them so there is no bug report until yours, so the developpement team probably don't know about this bug.
As Ico-Man frequently reads the forum, this information will be soon in developper's hands.
On the other hand, I personally think DVDs are obsolete, I rather have a 4,5 GB HD MKV file than an ISO of a DVD, as all of DVD's functionality is also implemented in MKVs ( multiple audio tracks, multiple subtitles, menus and so). But in terms of quality....you can't compare them.

As for an MPEG2 splitter, I am puzzled about. I use to test splitters, decoders....and after installing LAV filters foud that DVDs won't play anymore (BSPlayer just closes itself with no message). ISOs, instead, are opened with no problems, using Elecard's package (which is some 4-5 years old). Why is that, I don't know.

[SergeNL]

Originally Posted by BSPeter

IMHO..

IMHO?!.. If you're Humble enough, you don't need an opinion at all. You just listen to "His Masters Voice", and that's it.. :-)

Now, you have been around here since.. let's say World War One or something..
So you are the Master with the Voice , and I keep on moving my tail, having my ears right up , OK?

Originally Posted by BSPeter

IMHO icons/buttons shouldn't need text (apart from ''hover over" help text)

The point is: if a user wants - let's say - to adjust Color, he/she stares at the control panel.. The Button must be recognised. The faster the better. This is what "ease of use" means. And if there are a lot of buttons, it is a problem.

So Icons must be designed well. (In Kiss 3.0 I just improved some Kiss 1.0 buttons. I am not a graphical designer)
But it isn't easy to design recognisable buttons for let's say: Zoom, Aspect Ratio, Jump 10 seconds, and others.
So I think, adding English text to at least half of the buttons, is an improvement.
And some words are very international like Video and Audio.
Other words are very fast understood like Zoom, Color, Equaliser, Speed, or Channel. These words are around everywhere..

I think, adding these words can improve recognition a lot.

Again: I believe users can make choices for software on very subtle grounds, and I think recognition of Buttons or options is very important.

Originally Posted by BSPeter

"color" (/) isn't English but American English.

Sight... Yes!
And I did not exactly became more pro-American, since their Middle-East policies, that in fact are a massive huge crime..
Promoting Americanism isn't really a hobby anymore..

But the question "What exactly is English?", has caused many to pull their hair out..
For instance: Perhaps half a billion people from India speak "English".. You don't want to know what it exactly is, they are speaking.
Suprisingly, the Americans still call their language "English"..

Or here in the Netherlands (mention something, and we don't now shit about it ): 90% of all movies and TV-series are American.
I did have Oxford-English in school, and watch English crimi's, and watch the BBC (like "Have I got News for You", very hard to understand for foreigners), but the American English has become so common, I cant tell the difference anymore.

So already had pulled hairs out over the word "Color"..
I thought it was Colour, but I got doubts, and seached Google..
Point was, in my Kiss 3.0 design, it was one character too much..
So I silently began to use "Color", hoping no one would notice..
Then I bumped into BSPeter..

But I am going to win this from you. :-) Decisive may be the BSP code in Skin.ini..
BSP itself mentions "Color" and not "Colour" in the button settings, the Menu, and the Color-window. (a lucky escape for me.. )
But I do thank you for defending proper English..